Official English TitleEdit
- This is one reason why references are important, not just on talk pages but in articles where everyone can see them. Not everyone knows what you know at the same time that you know it. You need to anticipate reasonable challenges by backing up your writing with references. A sudden change of a movie's title is significant, and definitely something that readers would likely question.
- Since you found it, would you make the title change (and put in a reference) in the place where it is most obviously needed--the name of this article? -- BlueResistance (talk) 20:44, April 11, 2015 (UTC)
Goer's/Vandevel's fleet Edit
I watched the scene again, and it looks like the split between Goer's loyalist faction and those siding with the new government could not have happened yet. Before the Gatlantis attack, Vandevel says, "Apparently, Baleras has fallen and Chancellor Dessler has died in battle.” They were just getting the news, so there would not have been an opportunity yet for the division we see in “The Forever War” to happen, no real chance for anyone to choose to support or oppose the provisional government—or to find out that Dessler was actually alive despite the reports. As for the Zoellik issue, it is possible that there are those who are still faithful to him and who don’t like Goer. A potential death threat, though, is too specific without more evidence to justify having it on the page; without those specifics, it’s just creative speculation. -- BlueResistance (talk) 23:40, July 29, 2015 (UTC)
- For why he left the Zergutt II, he may have simply just prefered his old ship since it had a staff loyal to him and already had his personal quaters made up on board. For the split, It's quite possible Lord Dessler personally contacted Goer to take a few ships(Possibly Volunteers?) back to Balun(Though that doesn't explain why some of his ships were in Vandevel's fleet, since Goer could have simply ordered those ships to Balun).Another theory is that Goer could have ordered his ships to escourt the most powerful known ship in the Balun fleet back to Garmillas (since the fleet would have broken up to go to various destinations in the empire by this point) while he returns to Balun(presumably under Dessler's orders) with the 30 ships(Once again possibly volunteers) that appear in "The Forever War,"The fleet upon arriving at Balun would meet up with the Desura II, and remain there under Dessler's personal command.Johnatha (talk) 15:12, July 30, 2015 (UTC)
- Fair enough, all we know is that Goer was most certainlly away from the Zergutt II's Battlegroup during the Gatlantis assault. Which with the events of The Battle of Garmillas now being made known to the Balun Fleet, the logic I'm seeing is Goer probably was contacted by Lord Dessler at some point prior to the assault, possibily making him the first of the fleet to be aware of the regime change. We may also need a definte date for the Battle of Garmillas, so we can see how quickly the information spread, because the movie makes the assault happen aproximatly a month after the battle(Which makes no sense seeing how Goer and Dessler's cabnit had live communications prior to Domel's funeral). I'm also going to need to see if their is a source for the Desura II's speed(to see if he intercepted Goer's ship) or if the ship had hot lines to various commanders(to confirm that Dessler contacted Goer via those means). Johnatha (talk) 06:44, August 1, 2015 (UTC)
- There's no evidence that Goer was contacted by Dessler before the assault on Zergutt II--that's a huge leap of logic. Yes, as the highest ranking officer in the fleet, Goer would be the first to be contacted by Dessler and by the provisional government, but Vandevel is the next person in line (or one of the next). Why do you think he would have to wait much longer for information than Goer? On the communication issue, you seem to be conflating technological ability with willingness and permission to communicate. Just because Garmillas had the ability to contact the fleet right away does not mean they would have necessarily chosen to do so, for many possible reasons (the need for political stability before involving the military, just to name one). Dessler may have had his own reasons to remain quiet for a while--or maybe Desura II's communications were damaged in the jump from Baleras II and needed to be repaired.
- If you have access to the Japanese language novelizations of the Yamato 2199 series and of the movie, they may have additional concrete information you might use. If the novels don't provide anything, I don't think any other source (such as the Garmillas Mecha Book) would have anything to add. -- BlueResistance (talk) 05:58, August 2, 2015 (UTC)
- How is Dessler contacting Goer a leap of logic? Goer had shown no signs of disloyality to Dessler(As cellestia would have told Dessler after her trip to Balun). Dessler may have avoid contacting Vandevel for the reasons mention prior. As for communications we may need an exact date of the Battle of Garmillas since that date may mean the fleet may have found out about those event soon after the battle. On the Desura II I was just trying to get a time table on when Dessler and Goer's forces would have had to meet up/get in contact in relationship to the Battle of Garmillas, since the Fleet needed 3 months to get from Balun to Garmillas(I will check the countdown to extinction for the time between battles).
- No, in "Goer probably was contacted by Lord Dessler at some point prior to the assault," probably is the logic problem. Contact happened (obviously) but there's no basis for it being a "probably."
So what should we do with that text after the stub notification(after the Epilogue)
- Just delete the stub notification, since it isn't needed anymore. It can be deleted just like regular text.
- If you feel that the summary is too long, you can certainly return to it and trim it down later as you see fit (or another contributor can, as they see fit). There aren't any standards for summary length on this wiki yet, since so few summaries have been added. This article will help those standards to evolve. For now, I would recommend comparing it to other (higher quality) fan wikis for TV series, movies, and other media. As a general rule, a movie summary on a fan wiki should be longer than a summary for the same movie that you might read on Wikipedia. -- BlueResistance (talk) 22:28, August 26, 2015 (UTC)
- Well part of the reason I was asking was out of concern for length, but also for concerns of time. Combined, it took me 5-6 hours to process 100 minutes into text, granted with double checking and some editing involved. Recognizing that as this is the SBY Wiki it would be in the interest to catalog as much as possible, I just feel that having some kind of standard for word count might help with pacing in the creation of future summaries such as all the 2199 episodes, along with the original trilogy and films. --Legiondude (talk) 03:44, August 27, 2015 (UTC)